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Aragorn
Guest
|  Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 2:41 pm Post subject: [OT] Hardware question |
| Okay guys, it's that time of the year again when I have to ask a question
myself, and given that we've all known eachother for quite a while already,
I prefer to ask here over any other group... ;-)
The thing is - I've mentioned it a few times before already - that I'm going
to have someone build me a new system, and as I said before, I'm really
going to go crazy on this one - I have my reasons for going crazy... ;-)
Now, as you may remember from my saying it earlier, I'm aiming for the Tyan
Thunder K8QW (S4881) motherboard, which can (and will) harbor four
dual-core Opteron 8xx processors. I'm not sure on the clock speed yet, but
I'm probably going to go for the 865 HE (1.8 GHz) or 860 HE (1.6 GHz)
models. The HE version of the Opteron only consumes 55 Watts, while the
regular models consume 95 Watts and thus generate more heat. With eight
cores and a bunch of SCSI hard disks, you want it as cool as possible. ;-)
According to what I've read, a 1.8 GHz AMD should more or less perform
similarly to a 2.8 GHz Intel, and so even at 1.6 GHz I would already have a
higher per-CPU performance than with the 2.2 GHz 32-bit Xeons I have now,
not to mention that the new one will be a 64-bit machine running a 64-bit
distribution, of course.
Now, the thing is that this particular Tyan motherboard supports three types
of DDR-1 modules: DDR-400 (pc3200), DDR-333 (pc2700) and DDR-266 (pc2100).
With DDR-400, you can install 32 GB. With DDR-333 or DDR-266, you can
however install 64 GB.
And this is where I'm sort of at a knot... I'm not the kind of guy who buys
a new machine every year or even every two or three years - I'm actually
hoping for a five to ten year longevity for this ultimate dream machine -
and so I would actually prefer having 64 GB installed - given Moore's Law
and all... ;-)
Yet, what I don't know is whether the difference in speed between DDR-400
and DDR-333 is actually something you feel - as opposed to cold benchmark
numbers - so this is what I'm appealing to your own experiences and
knowledge for. I also don't know too well what the best choice would be
with regard to the chosen processor clock speed, etc.
Any ideas?
--
With kind regards,
*Aragorn*
(registered GNU/Linux user #223157) |
| | Back to top | |  | fred.fm
Guest
| | Posted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 7:17 am Post subject: Re: [OT] Hardware question |
| | Quote: | And this is where I'm sort of at a knot... I'm not the kind of guy
who >buys
a new machine every year or even every two or three years - I'm >actually
hoping for a five to ten year longevity for this ultimate dream machine >-
and so I would actually prefer having 64 GB installed - given Moore's >Law
and all... ;-)
Any ideas?
As you seem to go for a very good machine, and you never talk about |
money, i would suggest choosing the solution offering you the more
memory ;-)
--
à plus.
Fred |
| | Back to top | | | Aragorn
Guest
| | Posted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 3:09 pm Post subject: Re: [OT] Hardware question |
| On Thursday 16 November 2006 12:17, fred.fm stood up and addressed the
masses in /alt.os.linux.mandrake/ as follows...:
| Quote: | And this is where I'm sort of at a knot... I'm not the kind of guy
who >buys a new machine every year or even every two or three years - I'm
actually hoping for a five to ten year longevity for this ultimate
dream machine >- and so I would actually prefer having 64 GB installed -
given Moore's >Law and all... ;-)
Any ideas?
As you seem to go for a very good machine, and you never talk about
money, i would suggest choosing the solution offering you the more
memory 
|
That's what I was inclined to do, but of course other people's opinions may
shed a light on things I've overlooked myself. ;-)
As for the money... I already knew in advance that this kind of machine
would break my piggy bank for about worth half a car, but then again,
quality doesn't come cheap in this world, and I've already paid a lot for
machines that weren't really worth it.
This is especially the case for the way things went with this very machine
I'm typing this post on. I had ordered something completely different, but
then that turned out flaky, and the system builders refused to take my
complaints seriously because I was running GNU/Linux and "everything ran
perfectly with Windows" - of which I had stated in advance that I would not
be using it.
Eventually, they did take the machine back for evaluation, and they had to
conclude that I was right: something _was_ wrong. As I had also been
without a computer for six months before that machine got delivered while I
did need a computer, I was forced to buy a (second-hand) laptop.
It then still took them well over a year before they decided that they
couldn't get that machine to work properly - ironically, it was also a Tyan
motherboard - and that they would build me something else. However, they
were just stonewalling me, as throughout all of that time, I've been on
hold more than that I actually got to talk to someone other than the
receptionist.
Either way, they were going to give it "top priority", and it had even been
a topic at the management meeting, or so they said. So they started
building me this machine instead, and they threw in another 1 GB of RAM for
compensation... It still took many many phonecalls to the receptionist -
and that's as far as I got - and eventually I had to threaten them with a
lawsuite - not that I had a foot to stand on as they were a wholesale
company and they were not supposed to do retail - before they came clean
and delivered that machine.
My initial order - for the Tyan/AMD-based machine - was placed late
September 2001, and this machine here - based upon an Intel motherboard and
two Xeons - was delivered to me late March 2004... Also, this machine
doesn't even have an AGP slot. Intel did have motherboards of this
category with AGP, but the word with that company was that "they couldn't
get those"...
Either way, the machine was still not as it should have been when I got it,
and that one guy who had been responsible for the whole project had left
the company - after which they turned really nasty and suddenly refused to
do direct business with me.
So I ordered some new parts that needed to be put in this machine to bring
it more up to date with current standards, and that one guy promised me
that he would come and install them. I've got the parts laying here, but
the guy never showed up and never returned any of my calls - he doesn't
even pick up his phone anymore when he sees that I'm the one calling him.
Unfortunately, had I not had Asperger's Syndrome, then I would have known in
advance that they were screwing me. And in a way, I did sense that they
weren't playing it fair. It took them too long, and I don't believe in
coincidences. Not like that.
So now I'm having my revenge. I'm going to order me something that will
still be adequate and enjoyable for many, many years. Quality comes at a
price - unfortunately - but I've accepted that. As I wrote earlier, it's
better that I spend my money myself than that I give out loans to people
who won't even pay me back, and that includes my own brother,
unfortunately.
I'm not a big spender, but when I do decide to buy me something, I aim for
the best. With a life like mine, I think I've earned that right... ;-)
--
With kind regards,
*Aragorn*
(registered GNU/Linux user #223157) |
| | Back to top | | | Andy
Guest
| | Posted: Fri Nov 17, 2006 12:43 am Post subject: Re: [OT] Hardware question |
| On Thu, 16 Nov 2006 19:09:54 +0000, Aragorn wrote:
| Quote: |
As for the money... I already knew in advance that this kind of machine
would break my piggy bank
|
Aragorn! if Belgian money money is as colorful as Canadian, use Gimp2.3 |
| | Back to top | | | Aragorn
Guest
| | Posted: Fri Nov 17, 2006 5:47 pm Post subject: Re: [OT] Hardware question |
| On Friday 17 November 2006 05:43, Andy stood up and addressed the masses
in /alt.os.linux.mandrake/ as follows...:
| Quote: | On Thu, 16 Nov 2006 19:09:54 +0000, Aragorn wrote:
As for the money... I already knew in advance that this kind of machine
would break my piggy bank
Aragorn! if Belgian money money is as colorful as Canadian, use Gimp2.3
|
<LOL> Well, we don't have Belgian money anymore now. Most countries in
Europe - there are exceptions - have adopted the Euro and transitioned all
currency to it in February 2002.
And there are many bills, and even many more coins... So much even that
there already has been a proposal to drop the two lowest coins, and that
Greece decided not to manufacture the two highest bills - because they
represent amounts that will seldom be carried as cash by most people.
The bills are...
- 500 Euro
- 200 Euro
- 100 Euro
- 50 Euro
- 20 Euro
- 10 Euro
- 5 Euro
The coins are...
- 2 Euro
- 1 Euro
- 50 ct
- 20 ct
- 10 ct
- 5 ct
- 2 ct
- 1 ct
One Euro has a fixed value in old Belgian currency - the Belgian Franc, or
BEF/BFr - of 40.3399 BEF, and - at today's course - of US $1.28.
Normally, the currency symbol for the Euro - "¤", only visible if you're
using /iso8859-15/ or possibly /UTF-8/ - is prefixed, just as with the
dollar sign.
As for the final costs for this machine, I've been doing some more research
and calculating... It would seem that the biggest variable is the price
for the memory modules. I'd be using 4 GB modules, and to make up for 64
GB, I'd need 16 of them.
And here's the problem, because I've seen prices listed from 705 Euro for
one such module up to 2'000 Euro, so the end number may hugely differ,
depending on where you buy the memory modules. And they're not just
randomly selected modules, because I was looking for the Tyan-approved
modules only, and those are all ECC registered, with a lifetime warranty.
So in the end, this machine won't cost me half a car, it'll cost me a whole
car... :-/ But then again and as I wrote earlier on, I'm better off buying
this machine now - and I'll have to hurry because some of those memory
modules are even no longer being manufactured - than that I have to wait
for yet another scavenger to put on a sad face, throw an even more sad
story at me and request a loan.
There are four people who currently owe me money. One of them is my own
brother, and although he can easily pay me back, he won't, simply because
his wife mustn't know that I lend him money. And we're talking a huge sum
here - in fact, he owes me most of all, and that amount by far exceeds the
purchase of this computer I'm aiming for.
Then there's an ex from a very, very long time ago who came to borrow money
from me when she wanted to go live with this guy - she's already living
with her third boyfriend since him - then my ex-fiancée's sister who also
came to me for a loan, and then someone who used to be involved with our
IRC network but who turned out a real conman later on. And the fact is
that I've sued him, and he was found guilty of negligence and convicted to
paying me back in full, plus all the legal interests, plus the legal
expenses, but it's no damn use... :-/
The guy fled the country right before the trial - he drove to Spain, sold
"his" car there and he came back later in a rental car which he dumped here
in Belgium.
He's living his life just like anyone else now, except that he'll never
work. He's got everything that people normally have: a car, a cellphone, a
place to stay... Yet none of it is registered under his name, and so there
is nothing anyone can legally do to get him to pay me back, as officially
he owns nothing. Needless to say that on top of what he owes me for the
loan and the interests, he also owes me for the legal expenses to my lawyer
and to the courthouse.
So far for the justice system over here... :-/
--
With kind regards,
*Aragorn*
(registered GNU/Linux user #223157) |
| | Back to top | | | Ron Gibson
Guest
| | Posted: Fri Nov 17, 2006 5:47 pm Post subject: Re: [OT] Hardware question |
| On Thu, 16 Nov 2006 19:09:54 +0000, Aragorn wrote:
| Quote: | My initial order - for the Tyan/AMD-based machine - was placed late
September 2001, and this machine here - based upon an Intel motherboard
and two Xeons - was delivered to me late March 2004... Also, this
machine doesn't even have an AGP slot. Intel did have motherboards of
this category with AGP, but the word with that company was that "they
couldn't get those"...
|
Damn why don't you just build your own? Does the country you're in have
good vendors? How about NewEgg? Do they service your area?
I find the build it myself has a lot of advantages. One since you have
your head under the hood a good while you can spot any potential trouble
areas ahead of time. Two, you can research what you are buying ahead of
time and eliminate the buggy or not supported options.
All of the suppliers I use here all are very good about returns. Most
I've ever lost is $6-7 for return shipping. I won't do business with
anyone that charges restocking fees. The competition is so fierce here
that companies can't afford to get a bad reputation so most take returns
no serious questions asked.
My first PC was a Compaq. Grrr...on that one.
Next one, a year later was custom built by a company. That one lasted a
good while but since then I've built 12-15 machines myself I guess.
I bet stuff is really cheap for Wayne over in Japan. |
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